Are you guys concened about some of the subraces?

[broncoblitz]

Just make it so subraces are in a constant state of losing experience.

That way they have to be constantly grind monsters just to keep afloat.

Won't have to worry about interacting with them then.

But maybe im just a pain in the butt like that.

[Jay Four]

Hah, I like it. Actually I could go for all level 20s in that state :)

However, ultimately, when you lose in a unfair fight vs a ECL, you probably aren't going to be thinking "well, at least they had to grind for it". I know I wouldn't!

You'll be thinking "It's not fair that they're stronger" likely followed by "it's not fair that the only way to compete is to spend all day grinding". Maybe I'm biased 'cause I'm a fairly casual player.

[Media Brad]

Wipe all characters when Dasaria II gets out of beta. Then the rules will be set from lvl 1.

[BeyondRedemption]

We're still in Beta.

Exactly.

[broncoblitz]

A wipe really doesnt solve anything.

As a whole it hurts the casual gamers far more than others.

Legitimate IC racism will go a lot further towards discouraging the use of subraces than people give it credit for.

Start compiling information about the menace these races pose to the Empire and Im sure the local authorities will gladly institute laws negating any rights they may have had as a citizen.

[Grayle]

Setting the experience cap at 190,000 solves almost every problem presented. If that cap damages players' enjoyment too much, remove it.

That, and IC hatreds would go a long way

[Vlaid]

5. Requiring DM approval with a waiting period to any player wishing to engage in those subraces.


This is my favorite option. With the exception of possibly drow/svirfeblin being a tad on the too powerful sad, the races aren't all that overpowered. You seem to suffer light penalties a lot, even when it seems you shouldn't. People seem to forget to factor into the equation of the 'dark races', all you have to do is cast a level 0 spell and you just reduced their saves, skills, and attack rolls by 2. That's a pretty big downside. And it seems like just about everyone who can cast the spell, loves having it float above their head.

I would prefer an application process, because it would ensure only dedicated players who want to REALLY play the subrace, will apply to play them. And not the casual players who would be more suited to the more common races for immediate gratification.

Telling people that what race you play will determine if you get storyline help, is a bit on the elitist side. Every PC should have an equal opportunity to be a part of events, storyline, and plot developement. Even the drow ranger with two scimitars named Drizzit De'Orden, provided they RP their character well and stay IC. (Edit: Added to the end the sentence for clarification)

And what I've seen other servers do is cap the exp at 190,000 so races with ECL can't reach the same level cap as everyone else, which pretty much removes the penalty of having an ECL to begin with.

That being said, ECL is not a free meal ticket. You have to work harder for every level than everyone else. And if you compare a duegar to a dwarf, or an assimar to any other race, the benefit isn't as large as people make it out to be. Only two of the races really seem to have an obvious statistical advantage, and that's drow and Svirfeblin, which stems largely from the spell resistance, which is likely the most powerful racial ability one can have.

[k9burn]

And what I've seen other servers do is cap the exp at 190,000 so races with ECL can't reach the same level cap as everyone else, which pretty much removes the penalty of having an ECL to begin with.

This doesn't make sense to me. How does this "remove the penalty"? If anything, this is consistent with the ECL penalty.

[Vlaid]

If you don't have an exp cap of 190,000, any race can achieve level 20 if they grind enough exp. If there's an exp cap, a duegar will cap at level 18, a svirfeblin at 17, and so on. This maintains the feel that a human and a drow, with equal experience, are not the same level. This accounts for their special abilities they get from their race.

This does not punish anyone, as everyone is equally capped at 190,000 exp.

[mortannis]

about the xp cap. why punish everyone for people who want to take ECL hits? you want me to keep from getting more spells because you dont like the race of someone else? I am a basic elf.......

[k9burn]

If you don't have an exp cap of 190,000, any race can achieve level 20 if they grind enough exp. If there's an exp cap, a duegar will cap at level 18, a svirfeblin at 17, and so on. This maintains the feel that a human and a drow, with equal experience, are not the same level. This accounts for their special abilities they get from their race.

Yes I know this already.

Reread what I quoted in my previous post--carefully. I'm guessing you are missing a 'not' in there somewhere because its contradictory the way its written.

[The_Four_Horsemen]

New here just getting settled in... second post.

It seems to me that if everyone is really concerned about RP it shouldn't matter if someone plays and ECL race even all the way to lvl 20. If the lvl 20 ECL is an asshat they will be dealt with by the community / DM staff, just like any other non-ECL player.

Allowing the ECL races give players more choice to vary their builds, experiment, try something new, and all on the server that they enjoy playing on. If they are fun to play with and try and RP, does it hurt your gaming experience knowing that they are a lvl 20 deep gnome monk?

I started playing here, picked an ECL race (Drow), and let me tell you the xp penalty sucks. But I continued on, I want to explore the server meet fellow players and have fun trying to RP my new character. As soon as I got wind of there being a possibility of nerfing ECL characters or a vault wipe to implement new global character policy I stopped playing my char. It just seems disappointing to try and limit the player choices in this way. It should be all about the people behind the characters, RP and the great community.

[Greensleeves]

I'm loathe to even enter this discussion but I'll raise a few related thoughts about racial balance.

- The only races that are substantially stronger at level 20 than others are those with a natural spell resistance (Drow and Deep Gnomes).

- Apart from Drow and Deep Gnomes, the race of choice for experienced powergamers is usually human (and sometimes halfling). A good character builder can do more with a bonus feat at lvl 1 than they can do with any of the other racial bonuses (many of the most 'uber' non-caster builds require human/halfling specifically for this bonus feat, which enables them to combine feats or reach prestige classes that would otherwise be unattainable).

- From what ive seen, the great RPed racism in Dasaria is almost prevalent enough to balance things out and render the entire issue moot.

- I think toning down or removing the innate spell resistance would solve all balance issues (this could even be ignored... spell penetration can work wonders for offensive casters).

- If an exp cap is implemented without a character wipe, players should have the option to have their current exp and gear transferred to a new character with the same name, but a more 'acceptable' race.

[lockethrowsknives]

I am hardly concerned about the "overpowered" nature of these subraces. What bothers me is the fact that we have droves of drow and tieflings running around an oppressive, human based tyrannical empire that I don't think would hesitate in a second to mistreat and even remove said subraces from their civilized society.

The issue for me is campaign continuity, in conjunction with the 'Drizzt effect'. Bleh.

[The_Four_Horsemen]

I am hardly concerned about the "overpowered" nature of these subraces. What bothers me is the fact that we have droves of drow and tieflings running around an oppressive, human based tyrannical empire that I don't think would hesitate in a second to mistreat and even remove said subraces from their civilized society.

The issue for me is campaign continuity, in conjunction with the 'Drizzt effect'. Bleh.

This could make things interesting though. There could be an entire underdark city. Characters could spawn in either city according to race. They could fight each other or be forced to join forces against a greater danger etc etc.

- If an exp cap is implemented without a character wipe, players should have the option to have their current exp and gear transferred to a new character with the same name, but a more 'acceptable' race.

I like this idea, if things have to go that way.